Europa vs America - Some exchange of thoughts

[chris]

sorry but you know my english is not good
haven't say that Videorama(German studio)cut the watersports scenes?

[Mr_White]

Because German law does not forbid watersports.

And American morality has little impact on European porn.

....... since even European porn producers are very well looking for good sells in America, I still believe that American morality has some impact on European porn for sure. Just look at the example of Max Hc, to whom you already referred earlier. Once he openly decided to show and publish "obscene" material, he was immidiately dumped by his former US distributor and left to self distribution.

And now you really want to tell me that European producers nowadays won´t fear the same treatment?

[chris]

that's what i know is that:
American porn(even the Max Hardcore stuff)is like Micky Maous compared with the European porn!
ever heard about Subway films?
http://www.buyeuroporn.com/shop/subway-innovative-m-65.html

[sbando]

Again: there's nothing wrong with different tastes.
The problem arises in a forum when a majority ends up ousting a minority, any minority. Not everybody likes pissing contests. Personally, I can't go on bickering with Riley or Billy Bathgate for 10 freaking pages like some other people do or have done in the past. So, in the end, people like me stop posting at all.
Plus, the idea that the Internet is "located" in a specific nation, which is totally asinine, but very 2000's. What a laugh.
As I've repeated in numerous occasions, I miss the 90's and the wild Snow Crash days and Internet ethics and ng's netiquettes.

If you haven't done it already, watch a great movie called "Children of Men", it portrays these strange years perfectly.

[hardware]

Ah, a Neal Stephenson fan. I knew there was a reason I liked you, Sbando.

[sbando]

We had already discussed that at ADT, so it was a nod .

[hardware]

Had we? I'd forgotten.

[sbando]

Well, kind of. Remember that thread about the genesis of avatars? Man, has the Internet changed since then.

[Walter Burns]

sorry but you know my english is not good
haven't say that Videorama(German studio)cut the watersports scenes?

Yes I did say that. And I explained why.

Let me repeat it for you in baby steps. Mayby then you get it.

1. Videorama decides to release their backlog of videos on DVD.

2. They want to be sure that remastering their catalog and pressing DVDs is worth it and they don't lose money on the deal.

3. In order to do so, they want to reach the best target audience.

4. Old porn titles rereleased on DVD are mostly sought after by aficionados/fans, not by the casual porn buyer who doesn't give a shit or simply doesn't know shit.

5. Porn aficionados/fans are more likely to hunt for their porn on the internet.

6. So, Videorama really wants to sell their remastered DVDs in online stores.

7. Germany has the strictest age verification laws in Europe, severely restricting activities of online porn stores -- especially to non-German customers.

8. Videorama realizes that releasing their DVDs to German online pornstores won't suffice.

9. Orgazmik is if not the biggest at least one of the biggest online pornstores in Europe.

10. Which is why Videorama realizes that it really wants to sell their DVD's through Orgazmik.

11. But Orgazmik is loacted in Switzerland, where there is a no watersports law.

12. Orgazmik only agrees to sell the Videorama DVDs if the watersports scenes are cut.

13. Videorama agrees and edits out the watersports scenes in their classic videos.

End of story.
(Not really, because in the meantime the smart people at Papillon have released the Spanish/French versions of the Videorama classics on DVD intact. I have no idea how Videorama has reacted to that. They must know that they are losing customers to Papillon by now, since all of this happened at least 3 years ago.)

If you are asking me why GGG, John Thompson and all that other crap (yeah, you read me correctly) are not cutting the watersports from their vids, I guess there can be many possible (combinations of) reasons:

1) they release new stuff instead of old titles and hence can sell enough to brick and mortar stores and distributors to make it worthwhile

2) there productions are dirt cheap, so they don't need to sell as much as Videorama

3) they are braver businessmen than Videorama

4) Orgazmik has changed its policy and is accepting watersports now (I see that they list over 200 John Thompson titles)

[chris]

sorry but you know my english is not good
haven't say that Videorama(German studio)cut the watersports scenes?

Yes I did say that. And I explained why.

Let me repeat it for you in baby steps. Mayby then you get it.

1. Videorama decides to release their backlog of videos on DVD.

2. They want to be sure that remastering their catalog and pressing DVDs is worth it and they don't lose money on the deal.

3. In order to do so, they want to reach the best target audience.

4. Old porn titles rereleased on DVD are mostly sought after by aficionados/fans, not by the casual porn buyer who doesn't give a shit or simply doesn't know shit.

5. Porn aficionados/fans are more likely to hunt for their porn on the internet.

6. So, Videorama really wants to sell their remastered DVDs in online stores.

7. Germany has the strictest age verification laws in Europe, severely restricting activities of online porn stores -- especially to non-German customers.

8. Videorama realizes that releasing their DVDs to German online pornstores won't suffice.

9. Orgazmik is if not the biggest at least one of the biggest online pornstores in Europe.

10. Which is why Videorama realizes that it really wants to sell their DVD's through Orgazmik.

11. But Orgazmik is loacted in Switzerland, where there is a no watersports law.

12. Orgazmik only agrees to sell the Videorama DVDs if the watersports scenes are cut.

13. Videorama agrees and edits out the watersports scenes in their classic videos.

End of story.
(Not really, because in the meantime the smart people at Papillon have released the Spanish/French versions of the Videorama classics on DVD intact. I have no idea how Videorama has reacted to that. They must know that they are losing customers to Papillon by now, since all of this happened at least 3 years ago.)

If you are asking me why GGG, John Thompson and all that other crap (yeah, you read me correctly) are not cutting the watersports from their vids, I guess there can be many possible (combinations of) reasons:

1) they release new stuff instead of old titles and hence can sell enough to brick and mortar stores and distributors to make it worthwhile

2) there productions are dirt cheap, so they don't need to sell as much as Videorama

3) they are braver businessmen than Videorama

4) Orgazmik has changed its policy and is accepting watersports now (I see that they list over 200 John Thompson titles)

I got it now
seems i'm lucky bastard as never use online porn stores but rent or buy from my local videostores where i find all the good German and Italian stuff(uncut of course with a lot of watersports scenes).
tnx for the explain

[Walter Burns]

....... since even European porn producers are very well looking for good sells in America,

Again, which companies are you talking about? Private again? Come on. Their 'sell out' to their classic style happened 6 to 7 years ago, when they were already well established in the US. They had abandonned fisting and watersports pretty much after their first Private Video Magazine released in 1991. They didn't make a real impact on the US till 1995, when Woodman come into his own.

I still believe that American morality has some impact on European porn for sure. Just look at the example of Max Hc, to whom you already referred earlier. Once he openly decided to show and publish "obscene" material, he was immidiately dumped by his former US distributor and left to self distribution.

And now you really want to tell me that European producers nowadays won´t fear the same treatment?

Max was selling European versions in Europe through different European distributors like EFA, Puaka and City Lights for years before Legend cut him off. They didn't seem to care all that much about what Max did in Europe, till he made the mistake of rubbing their noses in it.
There are two very important differences between the European producer selling a 'safe' version to an American distributor and Max Hardcore losing his contract to Legend because of his European versions.

1. Max Hardcore only got in trouble when he tried to sell his European versions in the US.

2. The scenes were shot in the US.

Both these factors scared Legend to death.
Both these factors are irrelevant for European producers, as long as they are willing to release a 'safe' version.
Take Rocco. His deal with Evil Angel is still going strong and nobody in the US gives a shit that he has been releasing European versions in Europe.

[budtugley]

I'm an American who prefers European porn. I like ladies who look like the 'girl-next-door' and far too many American porn stars have boobjobs, tattoo's, and piercings that might appeal to some, but not to me. Euro gals are far more likely to look cute, yet be nasty. Wiska, Cherry Jul, Kathy Anderson, Monica Sweetheart, Lucy Lee, Sharka Blue, and many others have been favorites of mine over the years.
I lived in Europe for a couple of years in Germany and Spain and I have family members who live in England, the Czech Republic, and Holland.
Many Euro gals, take Monica Sweetheart for instance, visit the US to work in Porn Valley for a few months and they appeal to porn viewers on both sides of the Atlantic pond. Currently, Maya Gates is performing over here and she appears in many US produced films.
I also watch lots of Japanese porn but I do avoid the mosaic censorship titles and I watch lots of Brazilian porn. There are a few websites for fans of JAV that are conducted in English but there aren't any websites of Brazilian porn fans that I know of.
I post at ADT, I posted quite a bit at EBT, and I'm beginning to get my feet wet here.
Like I mentioned earlier, I prefer Euro porn and one lady who did many Euro films was Angelica Bella who never had much released in the US. I've had some films shipped from Europe starring Angelica but they're PAL and I have to use software to convert them to NTSC and then burn a blank disc. I'm probably violating copywrite laws but if Angelica's titles were available here I wouldn't be doing that.
It would be nice if some of the Italian and Spanish produced porn became available over here but too many porn hounds insist on English language dialogue so that's not looking likely as badly-dubbed film might be even worse.
Hopefully, in the not too distant future, porn titles can be downloaded via computer/modem in DivX which plays on some standalone DVD players. Companies like Evil Angel have that capacity. and do it today so that might be the norm shortly and people can then download a video and burn their own blank DVD's and they can bypass idiotic laws regarding matters like watersports (doesn't interest me) and fisting (that I don't get).

[hardware]

It's become fairly easy to find stand-alone DVD players that can handle both PAL and NTSC, budtugley. Walmart has even been known to carry some.

Thanks to the internet, Spanish and Italian porn is easy to find. It's the exchange rate that's a bugger.

[az]

I actually bought a DVD player at Wal-Mart that plays PAL here in the US. I'm at work now and don't know the model but if you're interested I write it down here tomorrow.

[dap-addict]

Thank you Walter for bringing this up!
I was wondering for some time wheter to start a tread dedicated to the US - Euro differences myself.

I recently stocked up with Hillary Scott daps and other US hardcore anal girls. Posting here I had somehow lost contact to the US porn scene, which a few years ago was an important part in my porn collection. And generally I have to say that the stock up was worth it, but I definitely do prefer Eurobabes.
One key factor is the language thing - since plastic tits invaded Budapest and Prague anyway.

that's true as Americans don't want to see girls who look like models in porn but some girls who just talk dirty in english!

I dont know what most american porn fans want, but talking indeed is one of the main actions an US girl (and girls working in the US) is supposed to deliver.
Just watch Sandra Romain before and after moving to the US!

In Europe it seems porn fans are still able to just watch the girl, watch her facial expression, hear her moan without asking for an instant translation of these signs. I dont mind dirty talk, but I do prefer the more subtle Euro way.